Clearing up the lies about 5 am
There are quite a few lies going around town by the people who want to keep the 3 am bar closings.
Let's clear them up here.
Muvico -- The lie going around town is that Muvico will leave CocoWalk if they don't enforce the 3 am closing time. Lie. Direct quote from CocoWalk management: "No such clause."
Why would a movie theater NOT want people around? Those are paying customers!
MADD -- Mothers Against Drug Driving are against the 5 am rule. They have not weighed in on this and I doubt they even know what the issue is about. I assume they would be against the 5 am closings though and also the 3 am and the 11 pm and any open bar. MADD doesn't want any bars to be serving drinks to people who may drive. But is it is a lie to say they are involved with this Grove issue at all.
Ironically, the 3 am rule has sent Grovites out to South Miami, Mary Brickell Village and South Beach and in turn, these people are actually driving home drunk, when they would normally be stumbling home drunk (if they are drunk at all, we are assuming here).
The next lie is that doctors, nurses, teachers and all the early risers are being accosted and run over by drunk drivers at 5 am. Can someone send proof of this? And if this is such a bad problem, why are we not protecting Wynwood and Mary Brickell and Downtown and all the other areas in the City of Miami? Why not make everyone close at 3 am so we all can be safe? Why are we only supposedly protecting the Grovites?
Lots of lies going around folks, created by about four people in town. They should be ashamed of themselves.
Fact: 95% or more residents and business owners want the 5 am closings back. Both Mayoral Candidates told me to my face as well as others at meetings, that they want the 5 am closings back, in the name of fair play, so that the Grove can compete with the rest of the City and County.
Fact: The majority, if not all of the Village Council members want 5 am back. The Chamber of Commerce wants 5 am back.
Another fact: I am not the one spearheading this return to the 5 am closings. I am just in agreement with everyone who is for it and I was approached by many people who asked me to write about it and also about debunking the lies that are going around town.
Let's clear them up here.
Muvico -- The lie going around town is that Muvico will leave CocoWalk if they don't enforce the 3 am closing time. Lie. Direct quote from CocoWalk management: "No such clause."
Why would a movie theater NOT want people around? Those are paying customers!
MADD -- Mothers Against Drug Driving are against the 5 am rule. They have not weighed in on this and I doubt they even know what the issue is about. I assume they would be against the 5 am closings though and also the 3 am and the 11 pm and any open bar. MADD doesn't want any bars to be serving drinks to people who may drive. But is it is a lie to say they are involved with this Grove issue at all.
Ironically, the 3 am rule has sent Grovites out to South Miami, Mary Brickell Village and South Beach and in turn, these people are actually driving home drunk, when they would normally be stumbling home drunk (if they are drunk at all, we are assuming here).
The next lie is that doctors, nurses, teachers and all the early risers are being accosted and run over by drunk drivers at 5 am. Can someone send proof of this? And if this is such a bad problem, why are we not protecting Wynwood and Mary Brickell and Downtown and all the other areas in the City of Miami? Why not make everyone close at 3 am so we all can be safe? Why are we only supposedly protecting the Grovites?
Lots of lies going around folks, created by about four people in town. They should be ashamed of themselves.
Fact: 95% or more residents and business owners want the 5 am closings back. Both Mayoral Candidates told me to my face as well as others at meetings, that they want the 5 am closings back, in the name of fair play, so that the Grove can compete with the rest of the City and County.
Fact: The majority, if not all of the Village Council members want 5 am back. The Chamber of Commerce wants 5 am back.
Another fact: I am not the one spearheading this return to the 5 am closings. I am just in agreement with everyone who is for it and I was approached by many people who asked me to write about it and also about debunking the lies that are going around town.
posted by Tom Falco at 3:00 PM
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25 Comments:
Thank you for correcting me, Grapevine!
having bars open till 5am is killing puppies and kittens. it is also causing global warming and daylight savings time.
:-P
Puppies and kittens killed will be great news for many grove residents....they are dog haters!
Thank you Grape for always cutting right through the bovine excrement.
I swear if it weren't for your blog these handful of Grove "activists" would be perpetuating these absurd lies and passing them off as actual facts. These few people have real chutzpah! Do they and their commander and chief Sarnoff think that they can erase 100 years of tradition in the Grove? How dare they! You moved to the Grove when... 1873? Unless you're well over 100 (which I believe one or two are) you moved here when the central business district WAS ALREADY HERE. I know that this is tough to accept but IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT YOU. There's OTHERS to consider such as sensible residents, tourists, merchants and patrons from surrounding areas. Why don't you few activists write up a lengthy Bucket list and hit the road.. Life is for living, bring back the fun in the Grove and let's be rid of these unhappy, miserable community activists who think just because they've got Mark's # on speed dial that they run the show.
There needs to be a good turnout at the village council meeting, otherwise all of our complaining will be for nothing.
Yeah Lee, good point, I want to see as many people there as I've seen posts on the subject.
I have lived in the grove since 1982 and I am an avid runner and cyclist. I get up almost every day at 5 am to run and bike. This drunk driving thing is a bunch of bull. It is more dangerous running and biking during morning rush hour with all the rude people rushing their children to schools and not willing to stop when you are in a crosswalk or people rushing to work. Also from 4 PM - 7 PM same thing people rushing home. These people usually are not drunk just rude Drivers. Also Testing while driving has become more dangerous as well.
rude drivers & texting while driving is a much bigger issue.
In closing I think drunks are more cautious because they are drunk.
You will NEVER get Sarnoff to accept the 5:00AM closing..it just won't happen!
RE: ANON 6:33
FYI, I absolutely agree with you. Sarnoff will never accept the 5AM closing, but that doesn't mean it won't happen. Thankfully we live in a democracy where the will of a few NEVER trumps the will of the majority.
Fact: 95% or more residents and business owners want the 5 am closings back.
I'd be interested to see that poll. How many of them actually live or own businesses in places that would be directly affected?
My one question about the 5am versus 3am bar closings is who are the people patronizing bars until that hour? do they have jobs? are we talking about two nights (ostensibly weekend nights) per week when you don't have a job or a class to go to that you would want to stay out that late drinking? if that's the case, how do you justify the other five nights? or perhaps the thought is that the people who want this so badly in the Grove don't work or go to University and it's all about them...
To the last anonymous, you sound like you don't get out much, I'll explain: They are tourits, locals and people who maybe go out once a week, once a month, or once a year, who want that option.
It isn't the same people out every night of the week until 5 am.
Since the Grove doesn't offer it, people take their business elsewhere and the Grove businesses are suffering.
Before all of you without a clue start going off half cocked, how about you take a walk up and down Commodore Plaza and ask questions of the restaurant and bar owners, so you actually know what you may be bitching about.
I used to own a bar. I closed at 5:00 am seven nights a week. I can tell you the crowd from 2:45 to 5:00 is rough. You would be surprised how many seemingly normal people are addicted.
There is no serious reason for bars to serve drinks after 3:00 am except to make more of a profit for bar owners.
People should be home.
I agree Anon 12:11. I bartended for three years while at UM and the 2-5am crowd were usually pretty horrid. I hope the city will do whatever is best for the Grove---but please be careful what you wish for. Thanks for the information.
Isn't the Village Council an advisory board - where do they think they have all kinds of powers? They haven't done anything productive for a long time and now that most of them are getting off the board they want a big push. It's like Manny wanting to be known as the Green Mayor on his way out the door.
I used to own a bar....
Is that right... and what bar was that that was open til 5AM? "People should be home"? And when did you have this epiphany? Nice try...
.... the only thing you 've owned or leased is a home in the center Grove!!!
Don't insult the readers of this blog S.M.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Besides bringing more business to the Grove, I have not heard any other good reason to sell alcohol til 5:AM.
Also, this has not even been supported by data. Restaurants and bars close all the time.
(To all of the anonymous: It's ok to reveal your name).
Len Scinto:
Because Tony...Why not? If there is no good data one-way or the other and positive and negative aspects either way then why opt for the "restrictive" option...Laws that restrict individual freedom are necessary but should be a last resort
RE: Mr Scoravacca.
You again... "besides bringing more business to the grove I haven't heard ANY OTHER GOOD REASON to sell alcohol til 5AM"
Tony, I love it when you throw me these slow ball pitches to respond to. Should there be any OTHER reason besides improving businessin the Grove?
Tony, I'm so glad that it was YOU to bring up a very important subject, "supporting data", especially when your mouth moves much faster than your brain. YOU were the one that claimed that the 5Am rollback was put on a ballot and was voted on by the Grove community, weren't you? Of course you recanted when Grapevine readers appropriately jumped your ass. All I've been hearing is you and your activists friends spreading all kinds of personal opinions, quarter truths and extremely flimsey theories on how detrimental this 5AM closing would be for the Grove. How bout YOU give "supporting Data", you know concrete statistics, that even a single business is responsible for all this carnage and mayham that happens when one or two businesses happens to close at 5AM. Where the hell is it? How bout just asking the city of Miami Police dept on stats for the last year and a half on DUI's, assaults, rapes, murders, jay walking etc.? With Flannigans still serving alcohol til 5AM surely there has to be DOZENS of police reports describing in detail all of the trappings that come with this 5AM license. Before you or any of your activists friends spew out any more crap please have some basis for your point of view other than gut feelings or astrological signs.
BTW Tony, I'm an aquarious.
Anonymous - I invite you to a public debate at a forum of your choice, with a moderator of mutual choice.... You know how to contact me.
Len Scinto, You make an excellent point, well spoken.
You are right about restrictive laws going too far, and I respect your opinion regarding the 5:AM alcohol sales. We have a difference of opinion and that's OK.
Others should understand that concept.
Tony, alright you're on. Whaddaya say we meet in the Grove at any restaurant or bar of your choice around 3:00AM-5AM???
..... wait a minute, that ain't gunna work.
Grape - why would any intelligent, responsible, Grove loving person, spread untruths and misinformation about something so important to the solvency of this community? I mean who would do such a thing and why? Are they themselves being misinformed? are they part of a group of people trying to make this community cemetery village, i mean century? i'm sure they realize that Muvico would welcome a vibrant nocturnal community. I’m sure they’ve realized that if we are not willing to be competitive in a recession such as this, the only thing we will see is more store closings. The experiment did not work. Spread the truth, no more lies. Even if it means someone losing their political seat.
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