About the waterfront parking garage
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| If you click on this image, you can see it better. The garage is at the upper left. |
A letter from Art Noriega, head of the Miami Parking Authority (MPA), defending his
Charles, [this is responding to Charles Corda, Grove activist who has been doing a lot of math on this project]:
Let’s set the record straight and so there can be no further embellishment of the truth you will now have a response, which I hope you will liberally share, directly from the source!
The conceptual layout we did months ago for the footprint that was included in the RFP allowed for a retail area of 40,000 square feet on the first floor with 211 spaces on the second floor and 230 spaces on each typical floor above that. So, if you actually do some real simple math, that would total 671 spaces for three floors of parking and one of retail MAXIMUM! That’s a total of 4 floors at a building height of approximately 42 feet. If, as I mentioned in the article, the shared use analysis determines that the need is less, we can reduce the size by a whole or partial floor. More than likely it will be less, but until that study is done we won’t know for sure.
So, to recap and to summarize the message to the entire Coconut Grove community:
1) Maximum garage height is four floors
2) Three floors of parking and one of retail
In the article I was very clear about the proposed building height and the approximate RANGE (500-650) of the space count. The facts are what’s important here, otherwise, someone might be under the impression there is a hidden agenda.
Feel free to contact me directly with any questions you may have regarding the garage development in the future since I will be the point person for the project moving forward. Also, if you wish, pass along my information and the facts to your entire contact list so they as well can benefit from the truth about what is proposed.
Regards,
Art
Noriega is defending himself against the claims that Coconut Grove activist Charles Corda brought against this monster garage project as part of the chrome and glass mall on the water.
Four stories? I have asked this before and I'll ask it again. Why is the Expo Center being torn down with the excuse that it's blocking the water, yet a four story (maybe more) parking garage, right on South Bayshore Drive, is not blocking the water? The Expo Center is a short, squat HISTORICAL building.
A four story garage is huge, the Village of Merrick Park is three stories and this towers over US1, imagine the garage and the mall on the waterfront -- no view, no breeze, no quality of life.
Also, keep in mind, parking is free there now. Since the MPA is involved, does this now involve paying for parking on our waterfront? And who gets this money the MPA? They did claim the decrepit parking area at Seminole Boat Ramp a few years ago as their own, by putting in parking meters. Even that quaint area is pay for play now.
posted by Tom Falco at 6:00 AM
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16 Comments:
NO to the Plan. It is more building space than grass areas and water views. The parking garage will be a big eyesore look at the Sonesta and count four floors up and thats what we will have. The sonesta has underground parking why can the parking gargae not be partially Underground. Also if the convention center is now an eye sore imagine it three storeis taller. If you Look at the plan carefully I did not notice any direct access to the water by the marina for the boats. As to the commersial space look at fresh Markaet location for years there has been a sign "space for rent" and if the plan calls for only business that have to do with boating I only see a Bass Pro shop making it in the marina that might be a good idea. This location can only handle two restaurant three will be to much competition thus I would say one location will always be opening and closing.The 3,000 sqft restaurant should be dedicated to grass area so that ALL can enjoy a direct water view day and night. City parking is getting out of control with the parking spaces soon we will have to pay to enter the park and then pay to park in the parking garage. Do not get me wron we need parking form the park but not 4 stories. I will bet that after it is built SARNOFF will then get the trolley to the park (what park)
The Community wants a Community Center not another failure with MPA and City of Miami involved! Look at Rice/Oak Ave Garage. Look at Marlins Stadium all MPA store fronts sit empty! The stores in the area don't get visitors as there is no parking. They already gave away the waterfront by Monty's and that parking lot which is zoned and gifted/deeded as a park! Pave paradise and put up a parking lot again? What is wrong with our Government? EVERYTHING! Wake up Miami Impeach our Commissioner now! Also what's in this for Ron & Joyce Nelson and Michelle Neimeyer ? There must be something in it for them why else would they be for this project?
The Village of Merrick Park's garage is many more than three stories tall. The mall itself may be three floors high, but those are mall floors, which are much higher than garage floors. For every mall floor you get two garage floors. Then there's the ground floor retail which will probably be higher than the standard garage floor but not nearly as high as Merrick Park's high ceilings.
Finally, the fourth floor of this building will be the rooftop parking, so you're really only talking one normal-height floor and two squat garage-height floors and a rooftop parapet that adds a couple feet to the height. It seems to me that the 42 foot building height quoted here would be going to the top of the staircases and elevators, which of course would extend above the roof of the building to give access to it. I would say the height to the top of the rooftop parapet would be closer to 30 feet.
Yes, a building on the waterfront is still a building on the waterfront, but it is by no means anywhere as big as Merrick Park, or even CocoWalk. It will be about the size of the Coconut Grove Convention Center, if not smaller. Go to a Lincoln Road garage with ground floor retail (420 or the New World Symphony. Not 1111. That's too architecturally atypical) and count up a few floors and you'll an idea.) It is not a 'monster' garage project.
Ideally they would make that spot parkland and find space for the garage somewhere on the other side of the street, but I don't think any real estate is available.
-Sean McCaughan
Editor, Curbed Miami
The Village of Merrick Park's garage is many more than three stories tall. The mall itself may be three floors high, but those are mall floors, which are much higher than garage floors. For every mall floor you get two garage floors. Then there's the ground floor retail which will probably be higher than the standard garage floor but not nearly as high as Merrick Park's high ceilings.
Finally, the fourth floor of this building will be the rooftop parking, so you're really only talking one normal-height floor and two squat garage-height floors and a rooftop parapet that adds a couple feet to the height. It seems to me that the 42 foot building height quoted here would be going to the top of the staircases and elevators, which of course would extend above the roof of the building to give access to it. I would say the height to the top of the rooftop parapet would be closer to 30 feet.
Yes, a building on the waterfront is still a building on the waterfront, but it is by no means anywhere as big as Merrick Park, or even CocoWalk. It will be about the size of the Coconut Grove Convention Center, if not smaller. Go to a Lincoln Road garage with ground floor retail (420 or the New World Symphony. Not 1111. That's too architecturally atypical) and count up a few floors and you'll an idea.) It is not a 'monster' garage project.
Ideally they would make that spot parkland and find space for the garage somewhere on the other side of the street, but I don't think any real estate is available.
-Sean McCaughan
Editor, Curbed Miami
The Expo Center blocks the new condo project, The Grove. Of course the garage will block the view of someone. Whats important to the current administration is that the view for this development is clear. Why? I wonder.
Parking at the site where the new garage is planned is not free. The Parking Authority charges $75.00 / month per space. The lot is mostly used by office buildings along Bayshore Drive.
I thought the top floor of the garage was supposed to look like an outdoor garden with trees and such. Not parking for cars. Also do we really need a mini Bayside in Coconut Grove. It is not just the parking garage we are objecting to.
I used to believe in my commissioner (Sarnoff) after he fought Mercy towers and a bigger Home Depot. Now he wants to undo that many times over with this project, contradicting his original intent with Sasaki to open up the view. The view from in front of the Charthouse is nice and should be public..a suggested by an above post. Families living here and paying high taxes deserve more for their money, which funds Community centers in Overtown and YMCA's in Brickel, and a watermark in NW. What do we get, a handout from St Stephens at Peacock Park and a some minor improvements like sod and rubber paths at Kennedy. Where can I go out with my wife and daughter for a bike ride and sit in a garden setting to mix with other families and contemplate.....no where! Plz be pro-active and hand out flyers to people who shop in the grove, business owners and PTA members to fight this obscenity of a waterfront plan. It does nothing for local residents who have taken it for too long.
Do you know what group is going to start forming the NO,to the Grove Harbour Project, YES to open waterfront? we need to get ball rolling
Many Coconut Grove residents will never be satisfied. I am sorry if everything is not perfect to your liking, but this plan sounds like a good idea. Everywhere around this city, structures that look a lot like this plan are going up and doing great things for the specific communities that they service. Look at Midtown, Mary Brickell Village, Merrick Park.... These places are booming because of ideas like this. People need to stop thinking about themselves and start thinking about the bigger picture, the community. The fate of this project should not be based on the opinions of angry residents that throw a fit every time someone mentions or hints at progressive change. People should be more concerned with what is best for the community. This place has turned into a ghost town. I feel sorry when I see the tourists that walk around the Grove looking bored because there is absolutely nothing to do. They must think to themselves, "I am never coming back to Coconut Grove, I'd rather go to South Beach." This project will also bring something that the Grove has been lacking from the beginning of time, parking. A lot of people do not come to the Grove because we have no parking, we never had. I am optimistic, we have a lot of potential here in the Grove to grow. It's obvious the current model sure is not working.
Yes we all want more parks. Many of us would also like more libraries, better schools, more police, more trees, a better economy, lower taxes, the reopening of the Playhouse, more innovative cuisine nearby, City Hall moving out of the Grove, less rezoning for more unnecessary condos and if possible Grove Independence. Personally I would like to be taller, thinner, wealthier and dating Penelope Cruz. But let’s face reality, few of those things are in our future. It is admirable that so many Grovites have taken an interest in the Grove Waterfront. It’s just disappointing that it took them so long to discover the many studies and efforts that have been in motion for the past 5 years. Removing Chart House and Scotty’s Landing and replacing it with a park is a great idea. Except that our City can hardly afford to maintain the parks, community centers, libraries, public pools and bike lanes, that we already have. The choice to replace the Grove Waterfront with a new project that will generate greater funds to the City of Miami will be included in the November election when we select the Mayor for the next four years. The refrandioum offers the voters two choices. Agree to support the new Grove Waterfront Project known as “The Harbour” or leave things as they are.
"SHALL THE CITY BE AUTHORIZED TO LEASE APPROXIMATELY 7 ACRES OF WATERFRONT AND SUBMERGED LANDS IN COCONUT GROVE TO GROVE BAY INVESTMENT GROUP, LLC, PROVIDING FOR 1) A MINIMUM OF $1.4 MILLION IN GUARANTEED ANNUAL RENT AND 2) APPROXIMATELY $17.9 MILLION OF PRIVATELY FUNDED IMPROVEMENTS TO REDEVELOP AN EXISTING MARINA AND PUBLIC BAYWALK, CONSTRUCT RESTAURANTS AND, PARTIALLY FUND A PUBLIC PARKING GARAGE, FOR A 50 YEAR TERM WITH TWO 15 YEAR RENEWAL OPTIONS."
The referendum will not include a choice to demolish Scotty's Landing and Charthouse and expand the area into a park, no matter how many folks sign a well-intended petition. So your choices will be to approve the new project, increase jobs, improve quality of food served and service. Or leave things as they are, with mediocre food, dismal service and little if any maintenance to the existing buildings and dingy bathrooms. “The Harbour” is the best Waterfront project that has been presented in the past year, through two separate RFP review processes. I am confident it is the best choice and plan to vote for it.
I'm still considering the ins and outs of this proposal, but there is something I want to point out. The proposed parking garage is not intended to just replace the one city-owned lot. It will apparently also replace the Scotty's parking lot and most of the parking spaces which now serve the Convention Center and Dinner Key Marina. The Convention Center parking is now free. Also, I wonder how marina residents are going to feel about having their parking so far away from the docks.
However, considering that the proposed garage is supposed to replace so many parking spaces, I actually wonder if they can make it big enough to cover all that without turning it into an eyesore.
Sophia
You know why this plan will happen? Because no-one cares. Grove residents care enough to write a few lines of fervent discontent with local politicos in blogs but have ZERO balls. You want more water views? Why haven't you gone over to Home Depot, purchased a chain saw and cut the ***** out of all the mangroves at Peacock and Kennedy? It would take you 20-30 minutes. Get arrested, pay the fine and get welcomed back into the community as a hero and get free drinks at G street. But nope...The will to make money and profit is bigger than your balls. That's it. You are sheep. Until someone steps up....shhhhhh...be quiet and enjoy the ride.
Unintended Consequences
Yes we all want more parks. Many of us would also like more libraries, better schools, more police, more trees, a better economy, lower taxes, the reopening of the Playhouse, more innovative cuisine nearby, City Hall moving out of the Grove, less rezoning for more unnecessary condos and if possible Grove Independence. Personally I would like to be taller, thinner, wealthier and dating Penelope Cruz. But let’s face reality, few of those things are in our future. It is admirable that so many Grovites have taken an interest in the Grove Waterfront. It’s just disappointing that it took them so long to discover the many studies and efforts that have been in motion for the past 5 years. Removing Chart House and Scotty’s Landing and replacing it with a park is a great idea. Except that our City can hardly afford to maintain the parks, community centers, libraries, public pools and bike lanes, that we already have. The choice to replace the Grove Waterfront with a new project that will generate greater funds to the City of Miami will be included in the November election when we select the Mayor for the next four years. The refrandioum offers the voters two choices. Agree to support the new Grove Waterfront Project known as “The Harbour” or leave things as they are.
"SHALL THE CITY BE AUTHORIZED TO LEASE APPROXIMATELY 7 ACRES OF WATERFRONT AND SUBMERGED LANDS IN COCONUT GROVE TO GROVE BAY INVESTMENT GROUP, LLC, PROVIDING FOR 1) A MINIMUM OF $1.4 MILLION IN GUARANTEED ANNUAL RENT AND 2) APPROXIMATELY $17.9 MILLION OF PRIVATELY FUNDED IMPROVEMENTS TO REDEVELOP AN EXISTING MARINA AND PUBLIC BAYWALK, CONSTRUCT RESTAURANTS AND, PARTIALLY FUND A PUBLIC PARKING GARAGE, FOR A 50 YEAR TERM WITH TWO 15 YEAR RENEWAL OPTIONS."
The referendum will not include a choice to demolish Scotty's Landing and Charthouse and expand the area into a park, no matter how many folks sign a well-intended petition. So your choices will be to approve the new project, increase jobs, improve quality of food served and service. Or leave things as they are, with mediocre food, mediocre service and little if any maintenance to the existing buildings and dingy bathrooms. “The Harbour” is the best Waterfront project that has been presented in the past year, through two separate RFP review processes. I am confident it is the best choice and plan to vote for it.
Coconut Grove is such a beautiful blue and green community. It is a very nautical, and at the same time a very serene atmosphere. I would not want to see a parking garage or buildings. I would love to see a beautiful park, with beautiful garden, outdoor trails, open movie or concert space. Just one chic restaurant, and one art museum and let the boutiques be at cocowalk,or main street. The Ritz carlton should buy the property along with community people living on the Grove. Go and visit St. Petersburg so that you can get a nice idea.
Coconut Grove is such a beautiful blue and green community. It is a very nautical, and at the same time a very serene atmosphere. I would not want to see a parking garage or buildings. I would love to see a beautiful park, with beautiful garden, outdoor trails, open movie or concert space. Just one chic restaurant, and one art museum and let the boutiques be at cocowalk,or main street. The Ritz carlton should buy the property along with community people living on the Grove. Go and visit St. Petersburg so that you can get a nice idea.
Build it and they will come...trust me but the old grove needs to clean up also the restrooms and places like moes and sandbar are horribly dirty and old decor.Duffys is going to run them out which is a good thing
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